MALTHUSIAN Interview.

Founded in 2012, Ireland’s MALTHUSIAN have cut a swathe through the underground with their mind-altering, chaotic Death Metal. After capturing the hearts and minds of many with their ‘MMXIII’ demo and the transcendent ‘Below the Hengiform’ MLP, they have released their long-awaited full length ‘Across Deaths’, a hypnotic, hallucinatory experience that will disorientate and delight in equal measure. This interview was conducted in August 2018.

1. Your latest album is titled Across Deaths. The name suggests potentially a belief in there being multiple realms of Death. What is the meaning behind the name? Does the title of the new album and do the lyrics on the album link with previous explorations of liminality? Or is there a greater exploration of other themes?

‘The name refers to a few things, but of course it contains the notion of liminality which is omnipresent in our lyrics. The idea I came across was that of the human mind being able to conceptualise different scenarios that we can project in our mind’s eye to work out strategies that can be used to save us from danger. By traversing across conceptual deaths by using these imagined scenarios we can reason how not to behave to ensure our future survival. This is an aspect that sets us apart from other animals as they literally have to test out every danger they encounter in real life, thus increasing their chances of extinction. Those sorts of concepts, the idea of extinction and also evolution of species across vast stretches of time, are littered across the album’s lyrics. The name also manages to capture the range of styles on the album, I think. It suggests that there is maybe quite a bit going on in the songs and so far from the reviews we have been reading, that diversity of styles seems to have split the opinion of reviewers right down the middle. Some find it too much, too noisy and too chaotic and others really like the unpredictable and wild quality’.

2. Developing from the previous question, how do you conceptualise Death? Do you view it merely as an organic phenomenon, as part of a general cycle of life, or as there being something more mysterious to it?

‘Death is mysterious; it’s the greatest mystery of all. Religions build around it, moral codes are centred on it and yet, we really don’t know much about it. Despite spending our lives responding to the changing seasons and witnessing the never-ending cycles of life, death and renewal, we still often have trouble fitting ourselves into that same natural pattern. We have dissociated ourselves from nature and regard it as some kind of novelty to be admired via television shows and occasional excursions in the countryside, but the reality is, that despite our best attempts to cosset ourselves from it with nice clothes, comfortable homes and nine-to-five jobs, the fact remains that we are ourselves nature. Logically speaking then, death is just a natural part of existence and not to be feared. We will die and rot into the earth, be eaten by worms and eventually become nothing more than fertilizer. But what of our soul, our spirit, the spark that gives us our personalities and guides us through our existence? Nobody knows. I suppose that is why we have so much fantastic philosophy, art, poetry and literature. It’s how we speculate on the unimaginable and try to give it form’.

3. In recent years, there has been a surge in the amount of bands in the world of underground Black Metal and Death Metal exploring the ideas of Gnosticism and the Vedic religions. What are your own thoughts on these schools of thought?

‘I know nothing about these things’.

4. In your lyrics, there seems to be a large amount of discussion about the changing of forms. The song ‘Forms Become Vapours’ seemingly discusses potentially transcending from the current state of being, if my interpretation is in anyway accurate (basing this upon lines such as “I heave against the shackles” and “Melt through the fabric of reality”). Likewise, an initial reading of ‘The Gasless Billows’ again conjures up the idea of potential transcendence from the current human form. Are these interpretations in anyway accurate? How do you view human existence? Is there a goal of transcending our current form to a higher state of being?

‘Your interpretations are spot on. I’d also add that there is something fascinating in the visual image of human forms dissolving and that is a picture I try to convey in the lyrics of those songs. I have no solid or set views on religion or that type of thing but I think that the human spirit (as opposed to an immortal soul- although they might be the same thing) maybe tries to find ways to manifest itself in the material world. Maybe that is why we are compelled to give form to our ideas which in our case is through our music and physical recordings. On one hand it’s the power of taking an idea out of thin air and developing it into something concrete, seeing how it changes when it comes up against your own limitations, and then seeing what happens with the convergence of all of our different ideas and skill sets. That journey is often tough going but is endlessly fascinating. It’s appealing to think that these little sparks of inspiration that we have can be recorded and left behind as a small legacy of our existence on Earth. And in a more banal way, perhaps, we are leaving our own little building block in the history of metal music that might become an interesting curiosity to somebody in the distant future, long after we have become worm food. As for a higher state of being, maybe that is achieved in our lifetime through the endeavours we undertake. Waiting around for something wonderful and transcendent to occur after you are dead is a bit fucking ludicrous when you could be actively doing something to enrich your life while you are still breathing, however humble or great that may be’.

5. As sort of hinted at in the previous question, when it comes to lyrics, you seem to try to hint at what you’re discussing without being explicit. Is this due to not wanting to proselytise? Or are there other reasons? Also, given that often religious or ritual experiences are near incommunicable and that your lyrics often have dealt with the liminal in the past, would it even be possible to ever truly communicate the full meaning and sensation that inspire your lyrics?

‘There is no reason for my lyrics not to be explicit other than that is the way they come out. I’m not an ideologue in any regard and have no message to sell. I simply find inspiration in things around me and when the creative mood hits, the various different sources I draw from all seem to find a way to coalesce. My lyrics are a bit kaleidoscopic and non-linear but there are usually a few threads of thought that bind them together to form a loose concept. I could conceivably communicate most or all of the lyrics’ meanings but I would have to go line by line and it would get confusing for all concerned. Some of the words express a visual image I might want to capture while others can stem from a word I have come across that looks interesting and has a pleasing meaning. Somehow these things cohere in my mind but trying to explain the connection might be tricky. You could say that the lyrics are impressionistic and expressionistic rather than proclamatory’.

6. In recent years, there have been a few cases in which modern science has confirmed the writings of ancient philosophers, with, for example, neuroscientists coming to support the conclusion of Aristotle that humans are not capable of consistent rational forethought until around the age 25. Do you believe that there are many lessons that the ancients can teach us? Have we forgotten some useful knowledge of life and the universe?

‘I’m no expert on any of this but clearly there have always been geniuses in the world, whose minds work differently to most, who see patterns where you or I might see nothing at all. However, in terms of science, most of these people’s ideas are the building blocks for the thinkers of the future. That said, new archaeological discoveries often redefine our understanding of our ancestors’ intelligence and technical capabilities, particularly concerning the pre-historic world, so it’s possible that a lot of wisdom and understanding about life and the universe was simply lost due to a lack of written recordings ’.

7. With the onward march of modernity, with globalisation and homogenisation of culture seemingly in a lock-step procession towards fields unknown, do you see there as being much space for liminal spaces in the modern world? Is there still a mystery in the landscape of Ireland, such as the ancient bogs where once kings were sacrificed to gods now unknown? How do you feel about these ongoing changes and their effect on traditional culture? Just that in a previous interview with another publication, you seemed to lament the lack of knowledge of Gaelic amongst large segments of the Irish population.

‘The world itself is mysterious, not just Ireland. It’s mind boggling when you sit and think about it for a moment. It might be corny to say, but the mere fact of our existence is mind-blowing, when you consider the vastness of the universe and how inhospitable most of it is toward life. It’s a wild and violent place that, if we were to venture outside our rich little oxygenated bubble, would crush us instantly, unmercifully. Somehow, through chance, or if you believe in higher beings then possibly fate, we exist on this incredibly versatile and mostly welcoming planet. And most of us put our heads down and trudge through our existence oblivious to just how lucky we are to have this experience. It’s something to consider now and again, to remind yourself that the fact that there is air in your lungs is, in itself, utterly miraculous. Then when you begin to understand a little bit about how the micro internal universe of our bodies reflects the cosmos, how we are all a part of a more huge pattern and are built up of miniscule similar patterns, it’s maybe possible to find some meaning in that. It’s equally possible that that sort of insight might destroy your sanity if you delve too deeply into it but it can make for an endless source of lyrical inspiration at least. You asked if the bogs still hold a mysterious quality in the modern world and for me they certainly do. I have worked on numerous wetland excavations and have always found those barren, lunar landscapes to be inspiring. They have a completely different atmosphere to any other landscape you will find in Ireland. That they are potentially littered with bog holes that can swallow grown men is enough to get the imagination working, not to mention the fact that in the past they were often used as the sites for some of the most barbaric killings in our history. How could you not take some kind of inspiration from a place like that.’

8. Andy, you’re an archaeologist and Johnny has studied an archaeology course at university. In archaeology and history, understanding a site or a text is highly dependent upon understanding the context, which often is lacking, obscured or missing. With this in mind, do you believe it is possible for one to ever truly understand the past? Will it ever be possible to fully understand the ancient bog bodies, the hengiforms, and the accumulated barrows and cromlechs that dot the landscape of northern Europe? Or have these sites lost too much of their original meaning?

‘Again, we can only make educated assumptions about these things as there are obviously no records from pre-history to tell us exactly what the function was for various features. For example, one of the more common archaeological features found in the Irish landscape are fulacht fias, which are usually horseshoe shaped mounds of burnt stone heaped around a trough that is cut into the earth. They are usually found in boggy areas or below the water table, but always near a water source. The theories for how they were used range from cooking food to making beer to bathing or even acting as a primitive sauna. As to their exact function we can only speculate and as they are generally free of artefacts like pottery sherds and bone which might tie them back to cooking sites, for example, so we can only speculate on their function. On the other hand, if you excavate a barrow site and find a skeleton within, then its function is fairly self-evident but we might yet have to hazard a guess as to who was buried here and why’.

9. Your fellow countrymen and Invictus labelmates Coscradh have written extensively about Irish myth, legend, history, and archaeology in their lyrics, with songs exploring the dark nature of Ireland. The lyrics for your own song Slouching Equinox from Below the Hengiform explores the nature of hengiforms and the rituals conducted within those liminal spaces that dotted the landscape of ancient Ireland. As you’ve also stated in interviews, lyrical influence has come from your work as an archaeologist and the archaeological history of Ireland. However, how would you say that this has affected your general worldview? How much of the philosophy and vision that guides Malthusian is inspired by your knowledge of ancient rites and ritual? How much is the music in part inspired by the ancient world?

‘The lyrics are partly inspired and often coloured by my work as an archaeologist, whether that is through direct terminology or trying to capture the atmosphere that some of these sites impart. But, as I hinted at earlier, I don’t tell stories or try to recreate historical events. These things might creep in either allegorically or simply to convey a mood or set a visual scene that I find appealing and they will usually somehow link back to other diverse ideas that I am toying with in a song’.

10. In previous interviews with other zines, you have stated that during the song writing process, you aim to overlap conflicting guitar parts to create a queasy, hallucinatory experience for the listener and to generate a particular mental landscape in their mind. How important do you see hallucinogens and hallucinatory experiences, in all forms whether chemical or artistic, in the creation of human culture and the music of Malthusian? Have you also ever considered experimenting more with noise in your music in a similar manner to bands like Knelt Rote?

‘The hallucinatory aspect of our riffs was accidental at first but something we explored a bit more on the EP, where myself and Matt would play conflicting riffs together and it would end up creating a new wonky and weird riff where the two intersect. There is a bit of that on the album but overall the riffs on the album are more tightly woven and structured, even if the rawness of the production might obscure that to a point. I have read of how hallucinations seem to throw up common imagery to recipients from vastly different cultures and who have had no contact with each other. It’s fascinating to think that either these people are truly communing with gods or are tapping into symbols that nature has programmed into all of our minds. Whatever way you look at it, it’s weird. As for using noise, we have used some in the past but with the album, because it was so focused on straight up old-school riffing, there seemed to be no place for noise on the album. In fact, we ended up getting Cossie from Lankum to come in and layer up some fiddle and viola at the end of ‘Primal Attunement- The Gloom Epoch’ as it made more sense to have a wonky aspect brought to the fore but with more traditional means. We think the results are far more impressive, organic and appropriate than merely mixing in some white noise which can feel like a bit of an easy option sometimes’.

11. Generally, liminality is defined by anthropologists as the quality of disorientation or confusion during religious rites, before the completion of ritual. About ritual, how important to you is the nature of ritual? Clearly it plays an important part of your work as an archaeologist, given that many sites are associated with ritual in one way or another, but would you say that it plays a role in the music or live performances of Malthusian? Do you see a gig as just a gig or is there something greater going on in each performance for both you as an individual and for the entire band?

‘We tend to veer away from the hocus pocus that some bands use because it’s not really us as people and it would feel fake and irrelevant to how we operate as a band. That said, when done well it can be a great experience to witness. We don’t partake in rituals when we rehearse, we just plug in and hammer out the noise and see where it takes us. Live, though, you can sometimes develop a really interesting buzz onstage between the band and audience when the mood is just right. The sound onstage has to be good, the sound out front for the crowd has to be good, you have to be playing the right slot during the evening, the playing and energy onstage has to be locked in and the crowd have to be recipient to the music and the energy, so there are a few factors that have to align, but when they do you really feel like you are sharing some sort of transcendent moment. Is that a ritual? Maybe’.

12. Religion and ritual seem to be somewhat integral to humanity. Some of the earliest archaeological sites we know include sites of ritual, including the potential sites of Neanderthal ritual in Bruqinuel Cave in France. Indeed, there are even potential signs of ritualised behaviours amongst both wild and captive chimpanzees when a member of the group dies. Is sapience connected with a sense of the mysterious, the supernatural, and the transcendent? Is it inherent in humans to seek states of liminality, to try and search for something beyond the self?

‘We seem to be wired that way, yes. Is it because there is something out past the fringe of the universe that is watching us and weighing up our behaviour and subconsciously beckoning us or is it programmed into our brains by nature and evolution as a way to prod us into activity and, ultimately, to spread our genes? I’ve no idea. We are always seeking some form of improvement, as a species, from the evolution of human rights, for example, to the incomprehensible work of scientists who are always seeking to find answers to the seemingly inexplicable. It’s a need we have, and that can’t be questioned, but I can’t say from where that need derives’.

13. Returning to the most recent album, how would you say that it differs the most from your previous material? And how do you envisage the ongoing musical evolution of Malthusian?

‘I think that it’s different to the other stuff in that we have dug further into the sound we began exploring on the demo and it has become, naturally, more complex. We took our time and worked and re-worked each song until we felt we had the definitive structure in place. Our music is chaotic by nature, we always end up using many riffs in every song and so they tend to become long and tortuous; it is a task to give all of those parts an aim and mould the various parts into a singular whole. It takes a while but we don’t stop changing things around until we know that the flow is right. I get that our music is too much for some people, too noisy or too chaotic or seemingly aimless. That’s fair enough, but this is how we write and these are the songs that naturally emerge when we get into the right headspace. For us to try to pare our songs down to four or five minutes with four or five riffs would feel completely wrong to us. I’m not a trained musician so I can’t dissect our songs in any great technical detail but having been into this music for a long time and playing music for almost as long as that, I can just feel when I play when something is right and resolves itself in a natural way and when it feels incomplete. There’s a weird vacuum-like sensation when you are writing music and a song feels like it ends too soon. It’s like the room knows that something isn’t right. We have some ideas for our next release but until we begin working on it we won’t know what shape it will actually take’.

14. There had previously been word of a possible tour with Triumvir Foul following their performance at Kill Town Death Fest, including but this seems to be no longer the case. What happened with this potential tour? And aside from it no longer happening, do you see in Triumvir Foul a band with perhaps similar beliefs or musical aims – e.g. an interest in perhaps creating hallucinatory audial experiences?

‘I’ve no idea what Triumvir Foul’s aims were when writing their music but they sound quite different to Malthusian to my ear- more direct and primal you might say. It’s a shame the tour fell apart but it was unavoidable as one of the Triumvir dudes got a new job and could no longer take the time off work to tour’.

15. Thank you for the interview. Do you have any parting words?

‘Thanks you for the interesting questions’.